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Season 3 :: Episode 4yogipreneur radio

Cate: Hello, everyone. We’re back. This is Cate Stillman with YogaHealer.com and I’m back with Amanda Cook of WellpreneurOnline.com and Racheal Cook of TheYogipreneur.com.

I feel like every time now I want to say that you’re not biological sisters, but you’re definitely connected in the wellness and yoga teacher/entrepreneurial space by more than just your last name. Welcome.

We’re talking about online versus working in-person and what’s happening. The last talk we did, I think, is going to really tie in — which was around exchanging value in the marketplace. I’m just going to say that right up front. If you haven’t heard that one, you should probably listen to that one after you listen to this one.

Who wants to kick this one off around working online versus working in person?

Racheal: I would love to kick this off. I have a lot of people coming to me who are hearing about going online and it really sounds amazing and incredible, but when I dig into where they are in their business — especially for yogis — it becomes really obvious to me that there’s a great time to take your business online. But, especially for yogis and people who are doing similar types of work,

I find that it’s very beneficial to get started, first, by actually teaching in person and then finding a way to translate that online.

I’ve just found over and over again that that’s so important for them to see that real interaction in person. There’s something about working with somebody in person — especially because you’re doing movement. It helps. You get so much information in an in-person session with somebody that you might not get going online where you have that kind of distance between the two of you.

I’d love to hear y’all’s insight on this. I just really feel passionately that yoga teachers need to teach before they try to take their business online.

Cate: I just want to — from what you just said — divide this into a few different categories just from that. You’ve got movement versus talking in what you’re doing online and then we also have gaining experience and how best that’s done. Then we also have something around the energetic exchange that happens in-person versus over video or audio.

All right. Now that I’ve categorized the conversation…

Amanda: Okay, so I completely get that with an in-person therapy and movement. Something like yoga. I think you would definitely need to do it online. But, if you’re doing something like health coaching, I’m not sure I agree you have to do it in-person first. I think Racheal mentioned this in a previous conversation. I think there’s huge value and you should absolutely work one-on-one first before you try to create a group program because working with one person and really getting into how this is working for them, where they have questions, where they are getting stuck, that’s what’s going to teach you what you need to put into a group program.

I don’t know. I’m not sure if it needs to be in-person, but I think it definitely needs to be a one-on-one connection for that type… something like coaching.

Racheal: Yeah. I think one of the reasons why I’m just really passionate about this is because… what is it? Like 70% of communication is non-verbal. It’s very challenging to get all the information from somebody if there’s a barrier between the two of you. The phone line is just… I don’t even see how that would be possible for yoga movement. You’d have to have video.

But, even then, there’s just so much nuance to it that I think there’s just something you have to learn a little bit from experience in-person in order to make that happen just on a communication level. You can have the exact same words in a session in person and via Skype, but you’re going to know so much more, I feel like, if you’re in person.

This might sound completely woo-woo, but I really do think the minute there’s a barrier between you — especially an electronic barrier — the energy shifts completely. It’s just a very, very different energy than if you’re in-person.

Amanda: I mean, I find video helps quite a bit. For me, coaching on just the phone versus with video makes a big difference.

Racheal: Yeah.

Amanda: It’s because you can read… you’re really reading the person’s body language and facial expressions and all of that. Yeah. Video helps, but you’re right, it’s not the same as in-person.

Cate: I think there’s a few parts to this that I want to get – I’m into the theming right now – and one is that you need experience. So anyone that doesn’t have experience and you don’t know how you help people, you need to take care of that.

Then, a lot of these other issues are going to fall away because you’ll have experience. You’re going to know what that long silence on the other end of the line means, and you’re going to know how to appropriately respond. Whether you’re on the phone or video, whether you’ve got the crappiest connection that you’ve lost five times… A lot of that can be taken care of just by being amazing at what you do.

In the beginning, and I think you’re going to really like this Racheal, I just have this gut feeling, you’ll have amazing market advantage if you’re in person! Like how much I’m gonna charge people to come see me in person could be way higher. Honestly, if you actually think about how this works, whenever you have an in person meeting, someone is usually moving somewhere to somewhere to go there. And usually there’s nice cities in the beginning and nice cities in the end, and those take time: time costs money. So already there’s more value being exchanged.

So if you’re just starting out and you’re just trying to help people and get experience, the market advantage of being in person is enormous.

More value is gonna be exchanged just because you have less [tech] stuff in the way and more of your desire-to-help energy is gonna be present, you can use your hands, you can give people things physically, there’s so many more ways to exchange value.

So if you’re trying to make more money – and that’s what I mean by exchange value, like be more useful/make more money – it’s a good thing to look at it that way because there’s a lot of ‘magic’, especially in Facebook Ads. I mean you look in your Facebook Ads and see “Just do a 5-figure webinar!” Have you guys seen those? There’s a lot of that out there, what I call the ‘fairy tale,’ that makes it look so easy online and you just have to do this and anyone can do it. And that, I think, confuses the novice.

Amanda: This is like the shiny object syndrome we were talking about in the last episode. “Oh, if I just invest in this tool, then I can push a button and revenue will start flowing.” That’s just not what happens.

The thing is, in order to get somebody to buy from you, they’ve got to trust you. Right? They’ve got to trust you in some way. That is a lot easier to build up in-person than it is online.

I’m constantly telling people if you’re in a position that you need money, do not go online to get money quickly. If you actually need a client to pay your bills the next month, you need to go out and meet a couple in person because —

Racheal: That is not the time to create a new program.

Amanda: No! Because unless you’ve been developing this community for several years and emailing them regularly and they really trust you and they’ve got an audience, then you can create a program and you’ll probably get revenue quickly.

For the vast majority of people, you need to get people to trust you. The way to do that, I think, is in person and face to face where you can really feel that connection.

Racheal: I absolutely agree with this. I would have to say, because so many of the people I work with are still working locally in-person, the biggest challenge they see when they go online is that something interesting happens. Like you said, it’s easier to get them to like and trust you face to face, but the other thing that happens is the actual length of time it takes to go from meeting you for the first time to being ready to exchange payment for services, that time shrinks. But, it almost lengthens out online quite a bit because there are a lot more steps to get to that point where you trust somebody to that level online.

I 1000% agree with that, that if you really want to dig in and get people to fill your client docket, the best way is just meeting them in person. I would have to say that, at Cate’s point, if I were to have someone to fly in to see me for a VIP Day and we spend all day together, the amount of time together might be like six hours together. It’s going to be so much more valuable for them to have that six hours with me in-person than if we break it up into six one-hour sessions that we do over Skype over a period of time.

You can get so much in in-person and experience so much more than you can… but it is definitely, I feel like, the highest value you can provide. If I want a yoga teacher who is going to come in and do yoga therapy with me, I want someone who is actually going to physically adjust me and who is going to bring some nice essential oils to help me relax or know exactly how to shift me to make me feel better. They can try to talk me through it online — and I’ve had that; I’ve worked both ways — but there’s just something about having somebody there to physically help you with that.

Cate: Great. So now let’s talk more to the person that is already doing both, because I think this applies to a lot of people where you maybe have some online courses or videos or some sort of product, or maybe it’s a service but you’re interacting live on webinars or calls or some of these hybrid things, and maybe still working in person. Maybe that’s through retreats or having drop-in yoga classes or doing consultations. So let’s talk a little about where it’s all going.

When I started out, everything was in person, and there was this huge swing of the pendulum to where a lot of stuff is online. And like Racheal just said, there’s a lot that’s just better in person and can never be that good online, so now there’s a little bit of swing to the pendulum, so maybe there’s a hybrid emerging where – for those of us that are experts in our field – we’re probably gonna be working in more of a hybridized model where in our services and products that we’re offering, both.

I know this is how I operate, and I see this is where the industry’s going, so I think this is worth noting, especially for those of us wondering ‘how do I do both? how do I do better?’

Racheal: Yeah.

Yeah, I really love this because, especially for the people I work with, I tend to see that — tying back into when we talked about the whole online and technology — a lot of them really start to feel distanced from their community and the people they’re serving if all they’re doing is hanging out in their home office. They actually start — they come back to me and they’re like, “I really miss teaching. I really miss being in front of people. I miss people I can actually reach out and touch and not just talk to on Skype.”

I totally get that. We have this deep-seated need for connection. For a lot of people, that’s where the whole fairytale of online is going to solve everything. You don’t realize how lonely it can be or how isolating it can be or how much you just miss people.

I think the hybrid option is just awesome because then you can choose: When I am in person, what do I really like doing? Maybe it’s not just teaching a group class every week. Maybe it’s, “I want to lead retreats. If I’m going to do something in-person, I just want it to be this incredible experience I’m going to take on,” and then everything else is more online. I think finding the right balance of when you are in person, what kind of energy you want to be spending and what you want that to look like, it really gives you so much more freedom than if it’s an either/or proposition.

I also think if you do a hybrid, it actually elevates the level of your in-person work even more. It starts to — I don’t know if you guys have seen this. Each time I add a new program, my one-on-one work starts to just… the value to it is even more and it starts to really create a nice group of offerings that help me grow my business without me being exhausted or burned out or anything like that.

Amanda: It raises your profile, I think.

Racheal: Yeah.

Amanda: You know, having a podcast and having these different programs, as you do this stuff it positions you as more and more of an expert and then your one-on-one services become even more valuable. Yeah.

Racheal: Absolutely.

Cate: I think you were also talking about something else Racheal which is that the value that you’re able to provide when there’s a hybrid, a tie of both online and in person, is so much more now than if you’re working with some people online and some people in person. That’s what I was hearing, is that what you were saying?

Racheal: Yeah. You can layer that value even more. Even in — this is something I’ve seen in my own programs and, Cate, I know you had this experience as well in your program you have. Coaches who also work with your students. I’ve got the same type of thing in Conscious Business Design. I have coaches who work with my students. I’ve found that this has been an interesting hybrid that not many people in the online space do where, yes, there’s a training available on demand, but there’s also access to people who you can talk to. I feel like that’s kind of an interesting hybrid.

I’m seeing more of that start to happen. People want more support and they want to be able to talk to somebody and get their questions answered. I have another program that I’m personally taking where there’s that, plus there’s a live event coming up in a couple of months.

Cate: This is huge. It has to go this way. I’m just so black and white about this, because it’s what will happen in such a short period of time.

And I don’t recommend doing events with people who are not in your programs. At a certain level of your business, you’re weakening the transformation people can have when the group comes together in person.

Amanda: Well, it’s a little bit off. It’s back to something Racheal said before. When you guys were talking about the fact that it seems like it’s gone from totally in-person to everybody’s doing something online. I think that’s a yoga thing. I don’t think that’s the case across the wellness industry, actually. I think there’s a lot of spaces — it’s definitely happening in yoga and I think in health coaching a lot of people are trying to do it online.

But, for example, I’m really into herbal medicine. There are no herbalists online. There are so few of them. Herbalists, if you’re listening, massive opportunity. I’m constantly trying to get the herbalists to go online.

Cate: Floracoepia! There’s doing great. They’re pro, doing a lot.

Amanda: Oh, I don’t even know her. Okay, or him. It. The brand. I don’t even know what it is.

I mean, there’s a few of them, but especially here in the UK, there’s zero. Anything that’s happening is in America. The same thing. I had a client who was an osteopath. Are they online? I don’t know if osteopaths are doing stuff online. I’ve just had a couple clients that were acupuncturists, which you would think, “Oh, you can only work in-person, obviously to do the physical acupuncture.” But there’s loads they can help people with in online programs.

I think that movement to online programs, it’s still really growing. I think, especially for people that are in a field like acupuncture or osteopathy or something where it’s maybe in-person, there’s a huge opportunity for a hybrid like you guys were talking about. I think in other areas, that’s still very much an area of growth.

Cate: So let’s look at this, how an herbalist could do this. Seriously, send this podcast to your favorite plant people, who are growing plants in your neighborhoods, that are doing CSAs, that are doing plant walks, people that know the ecosystems. It’s such an important thing to get out; we need you guys online.

Racheal: Yeah.

Amanda: Absolutely.

Cate: We also need you offline. When we look at where the market is going, what we see is that corbon footprint’s huge, the planet’s warming up, the penguins are dying. We know this stuff. So we look at this and can ask what is the carbon footprint of what I’m exchanging in the marketplace. Am I making everyone drive to me all the time? Well that’s foolish when we could be meeting online a lot, and then have a full day out here in the woods and we could all do our plant walk. But then when there’s all this stuff that we need to learn about, like what’s a diaphoretic and what’s a demulcent and what’s a carminative, we could do all of that like you guys and I are doing right now. And I could hold up the plant in its form, and show how I made it into a tea. We could do a lot of those things that may not be as conducive to do in the woods, we could do those in video format, or webinar format, or audio format. We’re adding more value, we’re bringing more plant awareness into our communities, and we’ve solved the problem of the online/in-person.

Racheal: Yeah.

Amanda: But the other thing you can do, which I’m super — I love that for teaching about herbalism, for example. But what if you’re a practitioner? You’re an herbalist and you’re working with a lot of people. You’re prescribing them their herbs in person, maybe. But there’s loads of dietary and lifestyle changes and just general support that needs to happen between visits.

You could easily create online support groups for your patients and meet with them once a week on a Zoom call like this. If you got groups of patients, like a whole bunch of women with hormonal issues or fertility issues — whatever it is — you could have a call like this. That’s huge added value for your patients. It fits into their life because they don’t have to drive there, you can still do the one-on-one prescribing/diagnosing in person, but you add all this extra support. It’s just… it’s awesome and the patients, I think, would get a better experience out of it, too.

I just think there’s huge potential there, but you have to think outside of the box of, “I only charge $40 an hour for an herbal consultation plus $10 for medicine,” or whatever.

Racheal: But now you turn it into a real —

Amanda: It’s a program.

Racheal: A real program that you can say, “Here’s the process I’m going to take you through. You’re going to have this incredible support group. You’re going to be able to get access to me and these other people,” which is huge. I mean, access to you is like the biggest value-add I think you can ever possibly add into what you’re doing as a service. I really love that.

On top of that, even someone like an herbalist, because yes, what they actually give you — I don’t want to book on how to make my own herbs for that, I want to go talk to you. But, I think there’s also other levels of leading into actually working with you that they can provide online. This is just education. I don’t know that much about herbs. Seriously, I’ve never been to an herbalist, so this is an area where I’m not educated. I don’t know if I’m ready yet.

But, if there was some smaller, on demand programs: on demand video training, on demand workbooks or PDFs that would guide me towards a consultation with you or that would guide me to your program, that would be a huge plus and a huge value-add to somebody even who is working in-person.

Cate: Yeah. And then they have an event with all the people that are in that Facebook group, where they have the option of coming together. It could be a bonus. Right? Then it’s just like, “Hey, as this Bonus, we’re all gonna just hang out for a day and I’m gonna teach a few things but we’re actually gonna do some group work, and reflect on what we’ve learned, and bring closure.” Then we can upsell to the next thing for the people who want to go into the higher level.

I think it’s just worth noting, for everyone listening, asking “Wow, how does this apply to me right now?” I think it’s going to be interesting to see, because a lot of people decide “I don’t really want to work online,” but then they realize that people wouldn’t have to drive as much, and what could happen if everyone can’t make a meeting.

I was interviewing someone sometime who does book clubs, and they only met once a month. And some people are bummed when they can’t make it, but they’re still involved in the conversation at the studio. I asked, “Are you recording it and just putting it on your website?” She’s like, “No.” Just record the meeting! Then people who are able to listen are even more connected, and they’ll be able to comment, and it just opened up this whole different way to see it.

And if we just start to look at everything that way, I mean, almost everyone has a smartphone. Almost everyone has one of these little headsets that you just plug in and now you have a little mic. As you have a discussion you just pass the phone around and it’s the easiest thing. So that’s the added value.

Amanda: So many it’s like breaking the stereotype of… I think people will think of working online and then they think, “I’ve got to do these launches and I’ve got to be putting myself on YouTube and I’ve got to be all this certain person,” that they think works online. That’s not true. What if that wasn’t true? What if you could just — like the examples you were giving — just incorporate it with what you’re doing and then share it so that people that weren’t there can participate. Or have support groups. Where can you use technology as a tool?

Use the online as a tool just to enhance your customers’ experience…

rather than thinking you have to become some super blogger/super polished whatever.

Racheal: Yeah. It can be so easy. It can be so simple. I have some yoga teachers, for example, who have been really focused on building their private yoga businesses, but they’ve been adding in this online component simply by they create private yoga practice recordings — they’re just mp3s — that they’re like, “I’m going to follow up after your session. Here’s your practice for the week. Here’s a handout for you.”

You know what’s amazing? If you do that long enough with enough people, suddenly you build up this incredible library of virtual content. Now it’s like you have an on-demand library of yoga practices that you can share. Once you create it once for one student, it doesn’t have to have their name on it. It’s like, we’re working on doing XYZ for you right now, record one that you can repeat. You can rinse and repeat. You can share it with multiple students.

That’s such a value-add because it’s like, “I’ve got this custom-created library I can share with multiple students. Oh, my gosh. Look at this. I’ve got 40 recordings here. What can I do with that? Oh, maybe I should put it on a CD or maybe I should make a downloadable playlist.” It just takes the smallest little step to get the hang of adding these value-added pieces, but suddenly — I hear from people over and over again. They’re like, “I started doing this and I realized I had enough worksheets that I can make a complete workbook I could sell.”

It’s just little pieces one at a time. It doesn’t have to mean — you don’t have to go straight to big launches.

Cate: It was coming from being helpful. It was seeing, here’s a need, and all of a sudden oh my gosh, I’ve built a world. And if it can help this person, chances are, it can help someone else.

So now let’s shift our conversation because we were also wanting to talk a little bit about – Is blogging dead? If we are a little bit more online, do we need to have a blog, do we need to have a podcast, do we need to be posting on social media all the time.

And as soon as we start talking about blogging…well let me just preface this: when I started blogging, it was mostly just for my students. And the same thing was true for my podcast. I already had a student body – now I call them members, not students, I feel that’s a little less arrogant and more true – so for my members, it was just an easier way for us to communicate online. It’s all just gonna be there. And then I learned a little bit about marketing strategy and learned that I can just talk about whatever I want and other people will be connected to me and maybe they’ll be a member in one of my programs.

So is it dead, if we look at this whole thing of blogging and how people are blogging. What part of it is less effective right now, and what part of it is still super-effective?

Amanda: I really want to talk about this because it’s something that — In the way I teach marketing, it’s very much content-marketing focused. I say you just have to pick one kind of content — either written, which is blogs, or audio, like podcasts or video.

I don’t know. I’ve recently been thinking: Is blogging still worthwhile? When I started my natural beauty blog seven years ago — and I was just blogging about all sorts of stuff and I get a really big amount of traffic on that site. It’s because of Google Organic Search. I’ve built up with these keywords over the years — not even intentionally. It’s just kind of happened that my site gets quite a bit of traffic.

But I’m just not sure… I’m just not sure that blogging is how it used to be. If I think back even a few years, I used to subscribe to loads of blogs. I must have read 20 or 30 blogs every week. I was really into reading blogs. Now, I read zero blogs. I don’t read any. I listen to a lot of podcasts and I get updates in my Facebook newsfeed and on Instagram. That’s where I am.

Cate: I mean, it’s interesting because a lot of our experts have books now too, where their book is more polished than their blog so it’s easier to get the information. Every week I think, I’ve just read the best book ever! I mean books have just gotten so good, right?

Amanda: They are so good. You can just download them immediately. Right?

Cate: Yeah.

Racheal: Yeah.

Cate: So I think that’s one thing, and the other thing is, you went right to – in a way – content marketing, which is one piece of it but it still has that marketing component of ‘this is how I’m generating leads for something that’s paid.’

Whereas what I’m going to is community building. So if we look at the function inherently: is blogging the best way for our listeners to generate people that are going to be great for their products and services, or is there another better way?

What is the best way in my online presence for me to connect with my community, and build with the community that is around my business. For the book on this we could go to Seth Godin’s Tribes.

Racheal: Yeah, I would say for me, it’s different — completely different — things. Where I go to establish my expertise/credibility/platform is still blog, podcast and, especially, email lists. Email list is — I mean, I can decide that I want to publish a blog or post a podcast, whatever, but either way they’re still likely going to get a reminder from me via my email list. It’s the biggest way I have to just —

Cate: But it’s gonna bring them from an email to a website, so all of a sudden, bigger content like a video – which you can’t send out through newsletter – now there’s a place for them to see it that’s not on YouTube, you’ve put it in a controlled environment.

Racheal: I still send people that way. I still send a lot of people that way. But, as far as the community-building aspect, I mean honestly, for me it’s been a Facebook group. Not a Facebook page, a Facebook group.

Cate: Yes.

Racheal: I stumbled on this by accident. About two years ago, I started a Facebook group for a free challenge that I ran. It happened to be two months before Facebook changed all their algorithms and all of our page views just dropped completely and reach dropped completely. But I have to say, groups are meant for communities. If you really want to get to know the people in your community and you want to provide just insane, useful value — not just sharing your content. Those types of groups, no one actually participates in. They don’t actually have conversations because all that’s going on is a like a big pitch fest.

But, the groups where everybody’s having conversations and asking questions and trying to get support… I’ve seen this happen, for example, in the DC Yoga Community. They started a Facebook group that was like The Washington DC Yoga Teacher Collective, I think is what it might be called. But they are so insanely helpful to each other and useful to each other and answer each other’s questions and share what they’re up to. That’s real community-building to me.

I’ve seen people do it in multiple different ways, but I think Facebook groups are one of the places that not many people think of to use as a way to start building your platform. But, if you create one and just start answering questions and talking to people — having real conversations — it will drive boatloads of people who know, like and trust you back to learn about what you have, even without hard pitching them or spamming them with links to your website.

Amanda: That’s totally true. Yeah.

Cate: This is such a great point, and as soon as there’s a resource that answers your question…

Amanda: They have to go through your website.

Racheal: Yeah.

Cate: And this is where you need a blog to have that content.

Amanda: That’s why you need a website. But, see, this is where — I think this distinction between community versus marketing. The reason the blog has value — I think — is so you show up in Google search results. You will at some point if you’re writing about your topic. New people will find you that way. If you are smart about making your blog posts the titles of questions that people are asking in your niche.

Racheal: Yeah.

Amanda: You’re going to start showing up and as a place to send people back to. Or, you can send them to an opt-in on the landing page. Like, “Download my free guide on…” whatever.

But, yeah, you need resources there. I don’t see the blog as really building community. I don’t think having a blog is going to make you famous anymore. You have to do something else on top of that. I think a Facebook group is great for that, actually.

I started my podcast two years ago and it was growing, but I never felt — I got some comments on the show notes, but it very much felt like a one-sided conversation. Then, finally, I started a Facebook group last year. That has just been incredible. Suddenly, there’s a real community where they all talk to each other. That’s where I think the real value is. It’s not just me talking at them, but it’s like suddenly I’ve made this space where they can all connect.

That’s exactly what Racheal said. When you can make those kind of spaces, that’s where you get real engagement.

Racheal: It’s so cool because the two pieces work together so incredibly well. Whether it’s a blog or a podcast or whatever, that should be showing up in the search results of Google. That is what helps drive more organic traffic to your site.
But here’s the thing. When you have that community and you’re basically having a test group here that’s telling you, “Here’s exactly what we’re struggling with. Here’s the problems we’re having. Here’s where I’m stuck; I don’t know what to do.” It’s like they’re giving you the answers for what they want to hear from you.

Now, your content gets better. You write more accurate blog posts. You give a better podcast. Everything becomes better and so they start sharing it more. As they start sharing it more, it goes up in the rankings, it gets more people coming to it and they keep talking because they’re like, “Yeah, this is awesome. I love this.”

I think the two together are really powerful because you’re co-creating with them. You’re taking what they’re saying, you’re taking their input and then really — I think a lot of people are like, “Yeah, I know what they want,” but they don’t actually do anything with it. Bu the minute you’re like, “Okay, this topic came up and I talked about it on my podcast. Here’s the question that so-and-so wrote about.”

They’re like, mind-blown. “I can’t believe you answered this question.”

Cate: I think that’s really where I was going to. There has to be a body of work that supports the conversation. Where the conversation happens with your tribe – it’s going to be on Facebook or a Google circle or whatever – it’s gonna be somewhere where there’s interaction.

And it’s such a great distinction: where is the body of work that supports the community going to live?

For some people who just have their podcast and iTunes, and they don’t have a website, it’s hard because there’s no home, there’s no home for that stuff.

So just in tying the conversation back, whether in-person or online, either way we end up creating a body of work. Just like Racheal said with those audios that are part of those privates for the private yoga student. All of a sudden there’s all this work and worksheets that can become part of a workbook. And if people have access to the same content, then the conversation is much deeper. If there’s no content in a group, it doesn’t go anywhere; the conversation is just…meh.

But if people are listening to the same podcast, or they’ve read the same blog post, or they’ve watched the same video, or tried the same recipe, now all of that lives on our site. Now all of a sudden, there’s a place for traction.

Racheal: Yeah.

Amanda: Totally. Where do you start? I think for somebody listening to this, they’re like, “Oh, my god. I need a body of work and it has to be on my site and then I have to have a place for engagement.”

It can seem… it’s not like you just click your fingers and this all appears overnight, right? Where would you guys recommend that you start? Start to build this?

Racheal: I mean, if they haven’t started creating blog posts or anything like that. They don’t have content, they don’t have materials that are ready. Then I would start by, honestly, creating a Facebook group. You can fill it with people you already know, you can start the conversations and let them tell you what they want.

In the couple of weeks or months it takes for you to really get a kind of understand of what they want you to talk about, you can start writing those or recording those or whatever and then launch a great site or a brand new blog or a brand new podcast with a few things ready to go that are like, “Boom. Here we go. Here’s the beginning of this.” That’s where I would start.”

Cate: I agree that Facebook is the easiest, for those of us that work with women in the 30-65 age range, like, you go to where people already are. You go to where your people are.

Amanda: I think if you’re just starting out, what I would recommend is you sign up for MailChimp and then you figure out what the one big problem you can solve for people is — your one issue — and create an opt-in gift around it so you’ve got something you can give to people. Then go into other Facebook groups where they’re already hanging out and just kind of participate in the conversation and see what they’re talking about. If you’re allowed, you can share your opt-in there, but you have to be a bit careful about that.

Just start to go where they are. Then, as you start to get people coming into your world, then yeah, create your own group. It’s awesome. It’s a great idea.

Racheal: Or take both of our ideas together and have a super idea.

Amanda: Create an opt-in gift in your on Facebook group and you’ll explode. Fast track to being on Oprah. Yeah.

Racheal: Definitely. Nice.

Cate: Awesome. Well this is a good introductory conversation on online or in-person and what’s happening in this space on so many levels.

Amanda: This has been so much fun.

Cate: This has been awesome.

Racheal: Yeah. This is awesome.


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